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Thread: [Problem] An open letter to Invasion/T4F

  1. #1
    Sergeant Major john35's Avatar
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    Exclamation [Problem] An open letter to Invasion/T4F

    Dear Invasion/T4F,

    Let me start by saying that I love and enjoy your game. However that being said, some things seriously need to change from your end. Mostly with communication to your customer/player base. The vagueness and sheer lack of details that you put out regarding new features and changes is infuriating.

    Here are some examples:
    1. Old Players (Character created a certain amount of days ago) will not be able to teleport to new zones.
    2. After the New Zone has been open for a certain period, teleporting will then be open.
    3. New Players (character created within a certain amount of days) will not be restricted and can teleport to new Zones.
    What exactly is a certain amount of days ago? What is a certain period? Do you know? If you don't, or haven't figured out that number yet, why are you implementing a half thought out idea? If you do know, why are you not sharing that information with the people that keep your game running? I am not a jumper, but if I was, and I paid money to your company for my account to have everything I was going to need to jump, I would be quite upset at the lack of details that literally just changed the game that I paid money for. Some people spend MONTHS building their jumper bases and several jumpers I know always make sure to have VIP4 before they jump. It is their strategy. So now you have customers/players who have paid in at minimum $40+ per base and MONTHS of their time building a base, and units, that no longer suites the strategy they laid out.

    -Added Shooting Ground, consume Simulator Chips to gain rewards.
    What "rewards"? They are not rewards. The Shooting ground is a luck based lottery system. You spend 500 chips and you get anything between a 3 minute speed up and diamonds. No rhyme or reason for how the "rewards" are dealt out. Just the same RNG that has failed at rss tile assignment. In game it says "after every 10 targets hit, get a big ticket item." But I do not consider a 15 or 30 minute speed up a big ticket item. How do you?

    -Added Guild Building: Maneuver Base, assign troops to maneuver and gain rewards.
    What is the purpose of this guild feature? How does it work? What rewards can be gained? Are there different rewards for different types of units? Are the rewards amplified if you send your Commander? Why can't you be in the Maneuver Base and in the Guild Mine at the same time?

    -Increased the Gathering Speed of the Guild Super Mine. Guild Super Mines will no longer yield resource to the Resource Bank.
    Increased the Gathering Speed by how much? Is the increased speed proportionate to the damage it will cause the Resource Bank when it no longer yields the 10% Bonus? And the Super Mines are on Guild Territory, why shouldn't it add to the Resource Bank? What is the reasoning behind this change? Are you trying to destroy small guilds? Force small guilds to merge with bigger ones?

    These are just a small fraction of what you have left us in the dark about. I understand that as the game grows, the need for changes will arise. But your lack of CLEAR communication is concerning. If you can't answer every question with clear, concise, and confident answers, then you are doing something wrong. And if you can answer every question with clear, concise, and confident answers, then it becomes a question of why are you not communicating with us BEFORE these changes are made so we can adjust our game play accordingly???

    A lot of us support your game financially because we love the game, but at what point do we stop and hold you accountable for changing a product that we have purchased? We hold up our end of the transaction every time we log in and play. We hold up our end every time we buy a package, whether it is a $0.99 or a $99.99 package. And even those who do not support you financially, support your game by playing and spreading the word to their friends and family about what a great game it is.

    The time for better communication is NOW. It needs to start NOW. Invasion/T4F needs to be THE reliable source of information about EVERY aspect of the game. About EVERY change, no matter how minor, IN ADVANCE.
    PeaceMaker80
    Zone 34

  2. #2
    Hi john! I am sorry for the delay of reply. First of all, we want to thank you for your support to our game and for your help to players on forum. We are sorry for the inconvenience. But we will be here to answer your questions.
    1.We are not giving an exact date because it is not quantitative. The system will decide the exact time according to the development of each zone.
    2.You could call it a luck based lottery. But we have calculated it. Overall what you gain is more than what you have costed. You might get one bad reward but you can’t ignore the better rewards.
    3.The purpose of Maneuver Base is just like guild mine or research center. It benefits you with rewards. And you could also use it as a way to hide troops.
    4.The purpose of this guild feature could not be defined. You could use it as a way to get some rewards when you are not online. Or you could hide your troops in it. The information of it is listed in Maneuver Base. You could check it after you sent your troops into it. The rewards has nothing to do with the amount of troops or commander but it’s decided by how much time you have put your troops in it. As for the reason for not being able to be in Maneuver Base and in the Guild Mine at the same time, it works just like there is only one building queue in your base.
    5.The bonus for gather speed is the specific data which could not be revealed.

    We are sorry for all the inconvenience. We just want you to engage in our game more. It would be more fun to discovery the information yourself. Besides you are always welcomed to post your confusion on forum or seek for help from CS in game. Appreciate your understanding!

  3. #3
    Second Lieutenant Malo's Avatar
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    More fun to discover yourself? Do me a favor, let me sell you a bicycle. It comes in pieces, and yes, a few pieces are missing, backordered, or fit poorly. Also, the instructions are in three different languages that unfortunately, you don't speak. I just thought it'd be fun for you to discover how to assemble it yourself. Oh and if you have trouble assembling it, contact CS and send screen shots of your inability to ride the bicycle.

    When the supermines were first unveiled, and the gather time was so doggedly slow that nobody wanted to use them, you said it would be optimized for better speed. A week later that changed to "its a great place to hide troops"
    equating having troops in the mine and troops on manuevers to a building qeue allowing only one makes zero sense from a game play stand point. By that logic, we should only have ability to send a single march regardless of HQ level or troop quantity.
    War does not determine who is right...only who is left- Bertrand Russel

  4. #4
    Sergeant Major john35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    1.We are not giving an exact date because it is not quantitative. The system will decide the exact time according to the development of each zone.
    You statement is contradictory. You say it is not quantitative, then say the system decides based on zone development. So it is, in fact, measurable. Zone Development of what is what is measurable. Is it: Power? Amount of Players? Amount of troops? Amount of Days?

    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    2.You could call it a luck based lottery. But we have calculated it. Overall what you gain is more than what you have costed. You might get one bad reward but you can’t ignore the better rewards.
    I am not disputing that the rewards are good. (Please keep it that way). But I was expecting it to be skill based (either speed or accuracy) .

    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    3.The purpose of Maneuver Base is just like guild mine or research center. It benefits you with rewards. And you could also use it as a way to hide troops.

    4.The purpose of this guild feature could not be defined. You could use it as a way to get some rewards when you are not online. Or you could hide your troops in it. The information of it is listed in Maneuver Base. You could check it after you sent your troops into it. The rewards has nothing to do with the amount of troops or commander but it’s decided by how much time you have put your troops in it. As for the reason for not being able to be in Maneuver Base and in the Guild Mine at the same time, it works just like there is only one building queue in your base.
    I have tired it out, and I cannot argue that the rewards given for spending 8 hours is good, maybe even outstanding, depending on what your maneuver chests gives you. It is also especially good for smaller bases and commanders that need the XP boost.

    However, not being able to march to both that and the guild mine does not make sense. If as a guild leader I can send 20 guild members to gather, 20 to go occupy, etc... why wouldn't I be able to do the same with the units on my base. I am sorry to say that you got this one wrong, and you need to correct the system to let us do both. Not letting us do both would be like not being able to hit your own rebels because you are rallied to hit someone else's.


    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    5.The bonus for gather speed is the specific data which could not be revealed.

    What specific data? Did you speed it up by 10%? 20? As low as 5%? Are you refusing to give this number because you know that the backlash would we epic. Because I can tell you that whatever addition to the speed you made, it is severely minimal. And makes almost no difference from what it was before. Personally, since it no longer yields extra to the guild resource bank, I think that it should gather as if you have the "Gather Master" boost on.


    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    We are sorry for all the inconvenience. We just want you to engage in our game more. It would be more fun to discovery the information yourself. Besides you are always welcomed to post your confusion on forum or seek for help from CS in game. Appreciate your understanding!
    I don't think you are sorry for the inconvenience, or you would have been more forthcoming with your answers. Some things can be fun to discover. A bottle of alcohol you hid in a boot to keep your roommates out of it, yes. A $20 bill in a pair of pants you haven't worn in a while, yes. Trying to figure out how new features and changes to old features work in a game that you financially support.... NO.

    There needs to be a "Patch Notes Release" posted for every upgrade, posted here on the forum a few days BEFORE the update with accurate, detailed information. This is not the only forum I am on for games I play. I even run a forum for our Alliance in one of my games. You can't keep your players in the dark, and expect them to have fun "discovering" what you have changed and how new things work. If you can't handle this, you need to hire a Community Manager for the forums to do it for you. (EXAMPLE: Marvel Puzzle Quest Forum Patch Notes Announcement)
    Last edited by john35; 03-04-2016 at 08:00 PM.
    PeaceMaker80
    Zone 34

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Malo View Post
    More fun to discover yourself? Do me a favor, let me sell you a bicycle. It comes in pieces, and yes, a few pieces are missing, backordered, or fit poorly. Also, the instructions are in three different languages that unfortunately, you don't speak. I just thought it'd be fun for you to discover how to assemble it yourself. Oh and if you have trouble assembling it, contact CS and send screen shots of your inability to ride the bicycle.

    When the supermines were first unveiled, and the gather time was so doggedly slow that nobody wanted to use them, you said it would be optimized for better speed. A week later that changed to "its a great place to hide troops"
    equating having troops in the mine and troops on manuevers to a building qeue allowing only one makes zero sense from a game play stand point. By that logic, we should only have ability to send a single march regardless of HQ level or troop quantity.
    Thanks for your time to share your ideas with us. Selling a bicycle is different from running a game. Besides we are still offering information in game. We know we need to make improvement and we are always trying to.
    Take the Super Mine as an example, the first time it were unveiled, we were collecting your feedbacks. We had received complains about the gathering time. Therefore we forwarded it to our project team and pushed for optimization. Our project team then explained it is not only a way to gather resources but also a way to hide troops according to the data after the release of Super Mine. Since players have complained that there is no way for them to protect troops. Super Mine was a better choice with the same gather speed. Our game is developing with our players and we are always listening to your voice. Thanks!

  6. #6
    Sergeant Major john35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    Thanks for your time to share your ideas with us. Selling a bicycle is different from running a game. Besides we are still offering information in game.
    When he talked about the bike, it was metaphor for how you seem to be running this game.

    As far as offering "information in game", that it yet to be seen. At least not useful information.
    PeaceMaker80
    Zone 34

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by john35 View Post
    You statement is contradictory. You say it is not quantitative, then say the system decides based on zone development. So it is, in fact, measurable. Zone Development of what is what is measurable. Is it: Power? Amount of Players? Amount of troops? Amount of Days?



    I am not disputing that the rewards are good. (Please keep it that way). But I was expecting it to be skill based (either speed or accuracy) .



    I have tired it out, and I cannot argue that the rewards given for spending 8 hours is good, maybe even outstanding, depending on what your maneuver chests gives you. It is also especially good for smaller bases and commanders that need the XP boost.

    However, not being able to march to both that and the guild mine does not make sense. If as a guild leader I can send 20 guild members to gather, 20 to go occupy, etc... why wouldn't I be able to do the same with the units on my base. I am sorry to say that you got this one wrong, and you need to correct the system to let us do both. Not letting us do both would be like not being able to hit your own rebels because you are rallied to hit someone else's.




    What specific data? Did you speed it up by 10%? 20? As low as 5%? Are you refusing to give this number because you know that the backlash would we epic. Because I can tell you that whatever addition to the speed you made, it is severely minimal. And makes almost no difference from what it was before. Personally, since it no longer yields extra to the guild resource bank, I think that it should gather as if you have the "Gather Master" boost on.




    I don't think you are sorry for the inconvenience, or you would have been more forthcoming with your answers. Some things can be fun to discover. A bottle of alcohol you hid in a boot to keep your roommates out of it, yes. A $20 bill in a pair of pants you haven't worn in a while, yes. Trying to figure out how new features and changes to old features work in a game that you financially support.... NO.

    There needs to be a "Patch Notes Release" posted for every upgrade, posted here on the forum a few days BEFORE the update with accurate, detailed information. This is not the only forum I am on for games I play. I even run a forum for our Alliance in one of my games. You can't keep your players in the dark, and expect them to have fun "discovering" what you have changed and how new things work. If you can't handle this, you need to hire a Community Manager for the forums to do it for you. (EXAMPLE: Marvel Puzzle Quest Forum Patch Notes Announcement)
    1.We state that it is not quantity because it will change accordingly. The time is indeed measurable but it is decided by many factors, like all you mentioned above.

    2.It might clash the purpose of our game. As our game is a war game not a shooting game. But it’s a good idea to add more element in our game. We will forward your idea to our project team.

    3.We will consider to adjust it according to players’ need. Please don’t worry.

    4.If we could tell you s specific number, we could never say the date could not be revealed.

    We understand that your complains come from your love to our game. All you want is to enjoy a better game. And that’s what’s the same as what we want. You could notice that we have made improvement and we will continue to. You are always welcomed to give us your feedbacks. Thanks!

  8. #8
    Sergeant Major john35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    1.We state that it is not quantity because it will change accordingly. The time is indeed measurable but it is decided by many factors, like all you mentioned above.

    2.It might clash the purpose of our game. As our game is a war game not a shooting game. But itís a good idea to add more element in our game. We will forward your idea to our project team.

    3.We will consider to adjust it according to playersí need. Please donít worry.

    4.If we could tell you s specific number, we could never say the date could not be revealed.

    We understand that your complains come from your love to our game. All you want is to enjoy a better game. And thatís whatís the same as what we want. You could notice that we have made improvement and we will continue to. You are always welcomed to give us your feedbacks. Thanks!
    I do not mean to come off as complaining. It was meant to be more of a constructive criticism. And that is because I see a pattern of changes in the game that will lead to veteran players walking away from the game. And while I should have recognized the the improvements that you have made in the game in the first post, this was more about getting your attention on the things that are being changed for the worse, not the better. Communication is one of those things. I see a lot of the same patterns and responses from the CS Team. Pre-scripted, non-specific statements to players that not only lead players who are on the forums, but the guest who visit, to believe that you don't put a lot of time and effort into keeping up with true issues in your game, nor do you take responsibility for game issues that are on your side. Now on to the responses to your responses:

    1- PORTING INTO NEW ZONES:
    Why would it change accordingly from Zone to Zone? If you have a metric in place that quantifies when a Zone can be open to jumpers, that metric should always remain true and the same. (Example: If you are basing it off of power, All Zones would open to jumpers when power of a zone reached a combined power total of "X", regardless of whether that was 1 hour or 1 week. Or if it is based on population, that metric is always a true sum. If you set your metric to population of 500, then again, once the population hits that metric, it opens to jumpers.) I am simply asking for the record, what value you chose and what you set that value at. I understand that if you chose a value other than one that is time based, that the opening will be different for each Zone.

    Also, you have yet to specify how old an account can be before it is blocked from jumping until the above metric is met for them to be able to port into the new zone.

    2- SHOOTING GALLERY:
    I have come to like the shooting gallery. I think the advanced is a bit too costly, but otherwise, it is a good addition to the game. And I understand that making it skill based will probably clash with the game. So you could make it a timed game, where the faster you hit the targets, the better the rewards. In the original post, I was merely stating that it should have been better explained before it was rolled out.

    3- MANEUVERING BASE:
    How do you adjust it accordingly to "players' needs"? To be fair across the board, this should be the same for a level 1 base as it is for a level 21 base. If you want to make adjustments, then make it hour based. 8 hours = X, 16 hours=XX, 24 hours=XXX, etc. And make it cumulative. If I spend 4 hours today, and 4 hours tomorrow, then I have reached my 8 hours and I get "X".

    4- GUILD MINE
    You did in fact say that there was no specific data that could be given. When in fact, there has to be data that can be given. The question is quite simple. By what percentage did you boost the gathering speed of the Guild Super Mine to offset the loss of it yielding to the Guild Resource Bank? I don't think that is such a hard question to answer.

    So far, you have not satisfied the simple questions that I have asked about the game. If you are not privy to the information about the game specifics, then it is time to get a Dev on this site to start talking to us.
    PeaceMaker80
    Zone 34

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by john35 View Post
    I do not mean to come off as complaining. It was meant to be more of a constructive criticism. And that is because I see a pattern of changes in the game that will lead to veteran players walking away from the game. And while I should have recognized the the improvements that you have made in the game in the first post, this was more about getting your attention on the things that are being changed for the worse, not the better. Communication is one of those things. I see a lot of the same patterns and responses from the CS Team. Pre-scripted, non-specific statements to players that not only lead players who are on the forums, but the guest who visit, to believe that you don't put a lot of time and effort into keeping up with true issues in your game, nor do you take responsibility for game issues that are on your side. Now on to the responses to your responses:

    1- PORTING INTO NEW ZONES:
    Why would it change accordingly from Zone to Zone? If you have a metric in place that quantifies when a Zone can be open to jumpers, that metric should always remain true and the same. (Example: If you are basing it off of power, All Zones would open to jumpers when power of a zone reached a combined power total of "X", regardless of whether that was 1 hour or 1 week. Or if it is based on population, that metric is always a true sum. If you set your metric to population of 500, then again, once the population hits that metric, it opens to jumpers.) I am simply asking for the record, what value you chose and what you set that value at. I understand that if you chose a value other than one that is time based, that the opening will be different for each Zone.

    Also, you have yet to specify how old an account can be before it is blocked from jumping until the above metric is met for them to be able to port into the new zone.

    2- SHOOTING GALLERY:
    I have come to like the shooting gallery. I think the advanced is a bit too costly, but otherwise, it is a good addition to the game. And I understand that making it skill based will probably clash with the game. So you could make it a timed game, where the faster you hit the targets, the better the rewards. In the original post, I was merely stating that it should have been better explained before it was rolled out.

    3- MANEUVERING BASE:
    How do you adjust it accordingly to "players' needs"? To be fair across the board, this should be the same for a level 1 base as it is for a level 21 base. If you want to make adjustments, then make it hour based. 8 hours = X, 16 hours=XX, 24 hours=XXX, etc. And make it cumulative. If I spend 4 hours today, and 4 hours tomorrow, then I have reached my 8 hours and I get "X".

    4- GUILD MINE
    You did in fact say that there was no specific data that could be given. When in fact, there has to be data that can be given. The question is quite simple. By what percentage did you boost the gathering speed of the Guild Super Mine to offset the loss of it yielding to the Guild Resource Bank? I don't think that is such a hard question to answer.

    So far, you have not satisfied the simple questions that I have asked about the game. If you are not privy to the information about the game specifics, then it is time to get a Dev on this site to start talking to us.
    1.We get a latest news for you. As we have received the feedbacks regarding the time of protection, players are wondering the exact time. We have made adjustment to show the exact protect time of each new zone currently. Please go to Map-World and click a new zone to have a check. Besides we have also collecting feedbacks about the exact date of a new account that could not be able to move to new zone. New account made within 7 days could be able to teleport the any zone when it meet the restriction of moving zone(HQ under lvl6 and with Newbie Teleport). System will warn you if you don’t meet the requirement.

    2.Feedback collected.

    3.Our game is a war game. Players want to involve in wars when playing our game. On one hand we are offering players ways to protect troops so they would not leave because of being unable to protect their troops, one the other hand we still need to consider about players who enjoy the wars so they won’t feel boring. Suppose that MANEUVERING BASE works like the way you mentioned, how about everyone’s troops could stay in it for good? Could players still enjoy the war if there is no troops unhidden at all?

    4.This statistic or what percentage could not be revealed.

    Thanks for your understanding!

  10. #10
    Sergeant Major john35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Invasion CS View Post
    1.We get a latest news for you. As we have received the feedbacks regarding the time of protection, players are wondering the exact time. We have made adjustment to show the exact protect time of each new zone currently. Please go to Map-World and click a new zone to have a check. Besides we have also collecting feedbacks about the exact date of a new account that could not be able to move to new zone. New account made within 7 days could be able to teleport the any zone when it meet the restriction of moving zone(HQ under lvl6 and with Newbie Teleport). System will warn you if you donít meet the requirement.

    2.Feedback collected.

    3.Our game is a war game. Players want to involve in wars when playing our game. On one hand we are offering players ways to protect troops so they would not leave because of being unable to protect their troops, one the other hand we still need to consider about players who enjoy the wars so they wonít feel boring. Suppose that MANEUVERING BASE works like the way you mentioned, how about everyoneís troops could stay in it for good? Could players still enjoy the war if there is no troops unhidden at all?

    4.This statistic or what percentage could not be revealed.

    Thanks for your understanding!
    1- Thank you.

    2- Thank you.

    3- I was not suggesting that they stay indefinitely. You can keep the same set up as you have now, just make the rewards accumulative. So in order for players to to reach each major milestone, they would have to remember to resend their troops, just like with the research center, you have to remember to donate every 6 hours.

    4- I don't understand why this percentage cannot be revealed. The developers said they sped up the gathering speed of the Super Mine. Myself and others just want to know by how much. Because from what most of us can tell, whatever increase was made makes no impact over what it was before. Most of us believe that they need to revert the Super Mine to the way it was before the update when it yielded the 10% bonus to the Resource Bank.
    PeaceMaker80
    Zone 34

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